On Wednesday, March 5, the University of Wisconsin-La Crosse Student Association (SA) heard from UWL Political Science Public Admin Professors Dr. James Szymalak and Dr. Samuel Scinta on the topic of free speech and the First Amendment.
SA also discussed resolutions regarding the Green Fund, amendments to the Student Services and Building Committee bylaws and a resolution that thanked Dr. Eugenia Turov for the work done on the Tutoring and Learning Center.
Dr. Scinta spoke first and brought up the free speech survey that students have filled out in years past and said that the results have shown that students are unaware of their First Amendment rights and how exactly they can exercise them.
Scinta mentioned John Stuart Mill, an American philosopher and economist from the 1800s, who wrote about the idea of liberty, specifically when the government can or should interfere with those liberties. Scinta read excerpts from Mill’s “On Liberty”, highlighting the importance of protecting freedom of expression. This concept, which has evolved into what we now call the “marketplace of ideas,” argues that individuals—rather than the government—should determine the value of speech.
One of the main points of this passage is that all ideas, regardless of whether we agree with them or whether they are outright false, have value. If we agree with them, they affirm our beliefs, and if we disagree, they make us think more critically and defend our ideas, while also strengthening our beliefs.
Scinta next applied these topics to our First Amendment rights in the United States of America.
He said, “We have very very broad First Amendment rights in this country. Very little speech is restricted, particularly when it pertains to political matters.”
Scinta explained that if we look at Mill’s theory, we can see that even speech that we disagree with, such as hate speech, is valuable as it reaffirms our beliefs and makes us think critically about our own beliefs.
“Hate speech, is constitutionally protected speech,” said Scinta. “The speech that we find toxic or challenging, is constitutionally protected speech.”
Dr. Szymalak spoke next and told SA, “I’m here to light a fire under your ass,” he said.
Szymalak explained that in the past, the UWL administration has attempted to illegally suppress students’ speech, and has received very little pushback from students. In response, he collaborated with the then-SA President and Vice President, to create a resolution to reaffirm the student body’s commitment to free speech.
Their efforts had little to no effect as many members of SA at the time were unwilling to acknowledge hate speech as protected speech under the First Amendment, and even once it was approved by SA, it was immediately shot down upon arrival to the faculty senate.
The resolution was in response to actions by the university to power-wash away chalking done by students in the School of Education (SOE). SOE Students had chalked in protest because they were dissatisfied with the dean and were demanding change. At the time, UWL allowed all chalking, making the erasure of the SOE student’s chalking viewpoint discrimination, going directly against student’s First Amendment rights.
One of the messages chalked by SOE students read, “Fuck UWL,” which the university did not want prospective students or families who may have been touring the school to see.
“They knew they were busting the constitution, but they also knew you wouldn’t do shit,” said Szymalak about the violations of the First Amendment committed by UWL.
Szymalak mentioned the new interim chalking policy put in place by UWL and recalled that there was no student involvement in the creation of that policy. Similarly, there was little to no pushback from students after the implementation of a policy that they had no say in.
“The university wins again,” said Szymalak. “The point is, don’t let them get away with stuff.”
The floor opened for SA to ask Szymalak and Scinta questions.
Senator Piarulli asked what thoughts the professors had on a recent post from President Trump regarding blocking federal funding for colleges or universities that allow illegal protesting on their campuses.
Szymalak said, “Right now illegal protesting is protesting with which you don’t agree. And that’s not the legal standard, it’s been really really unfortunate.” Szymalak continued to explain that protesting, as long as you are doing it in the correct time, place and manner is legal.
“The administration is most likely not talking about time, place and manner. They are most likely talking about content,” said Szymalak. “Suddenly it’s, ‘We’re going to find certain speech offensive, and not allow it.’ That’s very scary.”
Senator Lujan asked the professors if there are any particular warning signs to look out for that could indicate that students’ free speech is being violated.
Scinta reflected on the chalking policy once again and advised SA to observe how it is being implemented to ensure that it is being implemented fairly and transparently across the board. Scinta admitted that the new policy is better than previous policies, but still has room for violations of free speech to occur.
Scinta further explained that he believes chalking to be a less-than-ideal form of expression, as there is no active discourse between those who are doing the chalking and those receiving the message. There is no opportunity for ideas to be challenged or shared with chalking.
Szymalak and Scinta both shared concerns about the language of the interim chalking policy and described it as being too vague and the language too general for the university to properly enforce.
“The more precision you can get in a policy, the more you remove that subjectivity. which always leaves it up to the state, the government, to then determine what is good speech and what is bad speech,” said Scinta.
State Affairs Director Moreno asked how members of SA can express their personal beliefs while remaining bipartisan and non-biased when representing the students of UWL.
Scinta answered, “Humility.”
He explained that the only opinion you have control over is your own. Everything else is persuasive, if you have the humility to recognize that everyone has their own set of beliefs, and even potentially valuable information or views for you to draw from.
“I’m curious about all positions, I’m able to talk about all positions, I want to hear about all positions, because I can go home at night feeling very comfortable knowing what I believe, and I’m very happy with that, but I’m also very happy to let other people believe what they believe,” said Scinta.
Senator Kobussen asked what can be done to ensure that SA is a part of future policy decisions and what kind of language should be used to ensure that shared governance remains in place and student voices are heard in the decision-making process.
Szymalak shared that over the past ten years, he has seen what appears to be an effort from the university to reduce shared governance and the voice of students in policy creation.
“That’s what scares the hell out of me the most,” said Szymalak.
“Assert your shared governance, and say ‘no you can’t be doing these policies without involving us early’,” said Szymalak. “At a minimum, a final policy can’t go into effect without them standing here and saying, ‘vote on it, give us input’.”
“Understand too that you have The Racquet, that’s a great outlet, but you also have the La Crosse Tribune, they’ll always print anything you give them,” said Szymalak.
Senator Gray asked who would be the best faculty member to reach out to if students were looking to make an immediate change and didn’t have time to wait for a resolution to pass.
“I would start with the Dean of Students, it’s their policy,” said Szymalak.
The Dean of Students Kara Ostlund is one of the advisors to SA and was in attendance through Zoom.
Gray next asked who to speak with if the Dean of Students was unresponsive. “The Racquet, or the Tribune,” said Scinta.
Scinta closed by reminding students that both he and Szymalak are here for students and are available to help with anything that students might be concerned about. If you are interested in getting in touch with either of the professors, Szymalak’s contact information can be found here, and Scinta’s contact information can be found here.
Next, SA moved into officer reports. SA President Emma Latus reminded SA that the April 1 election is approaching and reminded them to vote. For information on how to vote click here.
Senator Lujan shared that the Center for Transformative Justice (CTJ) Campus Thread Fashion Show is on Wednesday, April 30, from 5:30 p.m. to 6:30 p.m.
Senator Bellisle said ASO will be hosting Feast of the East on April 4 from 5:30 p.m. to 9:30 p.m. Tickets will go on sale March 10. ASO will also be selling baked goods in the Student Union from 11:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. on March 27.
Senator Lutsey said that the Pride Center will be hosting the 21st annual drag show and the 4th annual art show on Saturday, March 29th in the Student Union Bluffs at 7:00 p.m. Tickets are on sale at the Welcome Desk and Information Center.
Next, Senator Hanstedt re-introduced a resolution that detailed changes made to the bylaws of the Student Services and Building Committee. SA had seen this resolution during their last meeting, which passed unanimously.
Senator Simpson introduced a resolution to approve the Sustainability Program Manager Green Fund Grant. SA made minor changes to the resolution and will see it again next week to vote.
Lastly, SA looked at a resolution thanking Dr. Eugenia Turov for the work that has been done to improve the Tutoring and Learning Center located in Murphy Library. SA will see this resolution again next week to vote on it.
SA will meet again on Wednesday, March 12, to revisit these resolutions and discuss possible new resolutions.
